November 2024
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    The way the Harry Potter fandom (and the reading community at large tbh) casually overlook the myriad of disturbing and offensive content in these novels is shocking to me. Especially given how many professed fans of the series are grown adults.

    (Spoilers for themes, plot, and worldbuilding of Harry Potter)

    >!The slavery apologia is by far the most disturbing content in Rowling’s work. I cannot believe a novel that was published in the year 2000 has extended passages of characters lifting arguments in favor of slavery verbatim from real world historical arguments that slave owners and racists used to justify holding human beings in chattel slavery, while at the same time continuously ridiculing Hermione as hysterical SJW for trying to advocate for the rights and freedoms of enslaved peoples. And yet the fandom will talk circles around you about how because the enslaved group (house-elves) are a fantasy race, that makes it totally acceptable to enslave them and repeat real world arguments that were made when holding African peoples in bondage in the Americas.!<

    >!The way people uphold Rowling’s books as radical anti-prejudice tomes of social justice while completely sweeping under the rug the ways in which she characterizes non-human creatures with vile racist caricatures is awful. House-elves are basically walking Uncle Tom stereotypes who love to be abused and mistreated slave workers. Goblins embody all of the horrid tropes of antisemitism with their huge noses and disfigured faces, associations with banking and wealth hoarding, and constant description as conniving and greedy. And the centaurs are coded as indigenous peoples who engage in capturing humans who stray onto their protective lands to meet violent and lurid fates.!<

    >!Rowling certainly isn’t a stranger to other forms of prejudice in her writing either. Her fatphobia is well documented in both Harry Potter and her later adult novels, which obese individuals being dehumanized in cruel and corpus descriptions of their bodies and attitudes. Rowling’s well documented transphobia is on full display with villainous character of Rita Skeeter, who’s constantly described as ugly, mannish in appearance, and with other non-traditionally feminine characteristics that are meant to make the reader feel put off by her.!<

    >!The series in general does not hold up to a feminist reading either. Women and girls in the series receive constant scrutiny and ridicule for both the crime of being ugly, and the crime of being too pretty/overly concerned with their appearances. The text in general heavily emphasizes parenthood (and especially motherhood) as the best and most righteous path for someone to follow, and indeed most of the characters we are meant to view as good who survive the series end up married with children. Though this heteronormative and judgmental outlook on gender and family isn’t really much of a surprise given what we know now about Rowling’s own personal believes on those things.!<

    It’s just all so awful, and it pains me to see so many readers simultaneously try and tout themselves as politically enlightened and socially accepting while turning a blind eye to all the terrible content in this series that’s meant for children.

    by snowwhistle1

    36 Comments

    1. As a literature major, you are the reason why I didn’t pursue graduate studies and realized academia was a lost cause.

    2. SquirrelTeamSix on

      Get the hell over it. I don’t agree with much that you wrote, but even if this were all true not everyone needs to live a sheltered mindless life. Bad things happen in real life and in books. Read what you like and leave others alone

    3. All this did was point out that you don’t know how to read or write critically… unless of course this is satire. If that’s the case keep the course because this is terrifying yet beautiful.

    4. thoriginalrumpshaker on

      I have plenty of beef with Rowling, none of which comes from me drawing comparisons between a fictional world she created and the real world. There is plenty of just straight up bad writing in the books to criticise if you want to have an actual conversation…

    5. This forum is so funny. Multiple times daily people will make comments about how JK Rowling is a shitty person with shitty ideas. And everyone applauds and agrees. But when someone writes up a post to explain how some of these shitty ideas have been there in her work the whole time, that’s somehow unreasonable and farfetched.

      Anyway, interesting analysis OP.

    6. Guys look at the username, they’re not serious.

      They’re a “snowflake dog whistle”.

    7. Adventurous_Lie_4141 on

      I don’t see it being grossly overlooked, your just in the wrong parts of the fandom. I follow several people on tiktok that break down the books and use them to make very good points about the things that are wrong with the books and the social cometary they present. One is a WHOLE ASS PROFESSOR that teaches the subject in a college and films his lectures, and their all about the problematic things in the fandom and critically thinking about them.

      It’s fine your upset about these things but don’t blast the fandom cuz you found yourself on the wrong side of the internet. Don’t blame us for your algorithm.

    8. Warm-Enthusiasm-9534 on

      Real talk, but isn’t this sub pretty disappointing? It’s just people dropping in, day after day, to write at length on why some book sucks.

    9. There’s one big glaring flaw, however: why the hell would J.K. Rowling, who’s spent her entire life living in Europe, write a book series where a bunch of the characters are based on American racial and ethnic stereotypes?

    10. Upon this basis we would “need” to discard entire genres.

      You’re welcome to do so but most of us just aren’t going to.

    11. Smartass_of_Class on

      I can’t even decide whether this is an unbelievably stupid serious post or an incredibly genius satirical one.

    12. thaisweetheart on

      *Sometimes it is okay to enjoy things.* Not everything you read has to be a critical analysis of race relations and discrimination, it can just be a cozy book about a magical school.

      You can criticize things and still enjoy them. There are a plethora of HP fans who have written fanfictions acknowledging the things like slavery, racism, etc. and honestly extrapolated better stories that JK came up with. The story is still nostalgic to millions of people. I say this as a leftist who is all for social justice.

      Edit: not the downvotes because I said it is okay to read things in a book sub… I think OP made fair points, I just overlook things because I read for enjoyment not analysis.

    13. I admire your sensitivity to these troubling issues. It’s my hope that this leads you away from this distracting space, offline to actively supporting those who are working in the physical world to alleviate the suffering that exists all around us.

    14. Masque-Obscura-Photo on

      Disclaimer: I have not read the books. Was too old to get into it, and later mostly learned that the writing was just bad, so I never bothered.

      Anyway: All I see you write here is how characters within the book act.

      I’m sure you can make the distinction between “characters acting a certain way in a book” and “the personal beliefs of the writer”?

      Is every writer who writes a villain or a world that is not some kind of social paradise a bad person? That’s a pretty shallow idea to be honest.

      It could very well be that she is holding shitty beliefs of course, I have genuinely no idea, but then why bother looking for clues in her books? What has she personally said that shows she holds those beliefs?

    15. >…real world arguments that were made when holding African peoples in bondage in the Americas…

      All other things aside, why is it always with topics like these that “slavery” in any shape or form is automatically referring to American slavery or, more rarely, general the transatlantic slave trade?

      People are acting like Americans and the British invented slavery, whereas it’s been going on for thousands of years all over the world.

      If there’s a perceived subtext about slavery, it’s almost always about American slavery, even though nothing actually points out to that specifically. How exactly are enslaved creatures in HP code for enslaved Africans specifically, and not slavery in general?

    16. babysamissimasybab on

      It’s clear that Hermione is right about house elves. We’re not supposed to be in favor of elf slavery, and the characters eventually come to Hermione’s side. Remember when Harry writes “Here lies Dobby, a free elf”?

    17. Dear gods of literature, please bestow upon us better media literacy.

      What is the phrase? When all you have is a hammer every problem looks like a nail?

      &#x200B;

      1. **Slavery**

      I feel uncommonly qualified to give a perspective on this as someone who has included slavery in one of their fantasy books. The thing about slavery is the people who enslave others think they are justified. And the thing about people who are against slavery in a place that considers slavery just, is that they are causing discord and therefore likely to be seen as a nuisance from that society. You can see this reflected in social perceptions of minorities in the modern day for reference if you live in a place without slavery.

      It is also normal for people who are enslaved to have different opinions on their enslavement. There were black people in America who wrote how they regretted liberation. That does not make liberation wrong or slavery right. It speaks to the mindset of the people (or creatures in this case) who are involved.

      Also, America was not the only place to enslave people, and it’s not the only kind of slavery that can be represented. JK isn’t even American She’s from the UK. Harry Potter is not set in America. It’s set in Britain. Not everything is about you.

      &#x200B;

      **2. Racist Caricatures**

      Your breadth of knowledge is narrow. I’ve heard these arguments before. They are weak. House Elves can be measured against any service role ever in the history of the world. It can, in fact, be measured against the modern day service industry where people sacrifice dignity and freedom for wages. The Goblins, it’s true, can be compared to Jewish caricatures, but they can also be compared to depictions of demons. Why do I think that bears consideration? Because in Abrahamic religions, it’s common to think of faerie characters as demonic. I was made to destroy children’s fairytale books as a child. I wasn’t allowed to watch Harry Potter because it treated magic as a good thing. These are the common perceptions of religions fundamentalists.

      I’m going to also point you towards [this](https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/54353/did-jk-rowling-ever-describe-harry-potter-goblins-as-hook-nosed) post. Where we see there is no reference to racist caricatures in the books, and the drawing lends weight (imo) to my demon interpretation.

      The behavior is normal for a goblin depiction.

      &#x200B;

      3. **Unfavorable Physical Descriptions**

      Ok, peek behind the curtain with me. What a character looks like, especially in children’s books, is often part of the storytelling. Hermione is described with ‘busy brown hair and buck teeth’. Why? Because she’s a nerd who isn’t conventionally attractive and leans towards having a boring personality. Malfoy as being pale, slender with a pointed face and icy eyes. His physical description speaks to his character. Hagrid is described as almost twice as tall and five times as wide as a normal man. Rita Skeeter is described as having a fancy feminine hairstyle and painted nails. There is no weight I can give to your accusations here at all.

      4. **Sexism**

      First, I would like some quotes to emphasize your point here, as I’m not actually sure what you’re thinking of.

      That said, it would be perfectly reasonable for female characters to be treated this way as it is an International experience in the real world, and likely something that Rowling would have experienced herself. There is no reason why it would be absent in the wizarding world. As to parenthood, there are plenty of people in this series who do not have kids and are not shamed for their lack of children. While I’m inclined to come down on the same side as you because of what I know about Mormonism, I don’t see enough justification for this point to hold.

      It makes far more sense that some of the most notable characters in the series would have kids to keep open the option to expand the series into the next generation. Also, there were straight romances included in the series and an absurd number of literary reasons why these characters specifically would have kids. I’ll also point out that this is *after a war*. It is common for birth rates to go up when a war ends.

      &#x200B;

      If you have any questions about things from a writers perspective, I often write things that are not okay, palatable or encouraged in the real world. You are welcome to ask me anything if you think my perspective can offer clarity.

    18. You’re right and you should say it tbh.

      It’d be one thing if she improved these things as time has gone on, but instead she’s quadrupled down on them in her espoused beliefs and recent offerings in the series.

    19. I agree with most of your points, OP. In fact, I think many of your criticisms were pointed out by Lindsay Ellis or Shawn on YouTube. You could check them out if you haven’t, I think you’ll like them.

      I’m pretty amazed at how negative the reaction has been. It seems like you’ve touched a nerve here, because it’s not like you said anything that was that controversial really. I guess you’ve committed the terrible crime of analysing the dearest book of many people.

      I think it’s very ironic that people from a literature subreddit can’t manage to understand that criticism of the contents of the book is not the same as banning a book, or banning you reading that book, or making you feel bad for enjoying that book. I honestly think at times that some people have developed an unhealthy attachment to HP. It’s perfectly ok to enjoy them. I know people who reread the series every year and are perfectly aware of the valid criticisms of the book.

      I mean, Dostoevsky is one of my favorite writers, and I remember that one of the notes from the Karamazov Brothers edition I read specifically mentioned that he was an antisemite, and I’m pretty sure that someone who decides to translate an 800 page novel has some appreciation for the work. It’s part of becoming an adult to understand that the people you admire are not perfect, and sometimes they even suck. And yes, sometimes their personality transpires their work.

      A similar thing happened recently in my country when a Twitter drama started when people questioned the way many females are represented in the videogame Metal Gear Solid series. I think most of the criticisms were reasonable, and I know for a fact that they came from some of the biggest fans.

      I’m sorry you received so much backslash from rabid fans. I didn’t expect such a reaction from this sub. Honestly disappointed at how bad they’re being rational and critical thinkers.

    20. ILoveMy-KindlePW on

      You are on the Steven Universe subreddit, ergo I’m not gonna read how you felt personally offended by a saga made for children

    21. I agree on the antisemitism, although in all fairness it comes more from folklore and the implicit traits associated with the mythical/folkloric creatures involved rather than from the author’s ideas or intentions. And the movies … well that’s where I think they did screw up.

      As for slavery apology: you are mistaken. For a very long time I bothered to try and understand why some people just can’t realize that. I don’t care that much anymore, especially in the age of having infinite knowledge at our fingertips. Word’s coming out of a character’s mouth aren’t necessarily the author’s convictions and many, many writers use their characters and heroes to voice the opposite of what the authors mean to convey in order to show how ridiculous or harmful those ideas are. It’s very very common in fiction and in the simpler writings the hero ends up visibly learning they were wrong. In the more sophisticated ones maybe you don’t even get that, you just have to acknowledge the hero never learns. But YOU, the reader should.

      As for them being sexist… huh? Is it because they show certain very sexist characters? Did that bother you? Then the books attained their objective.

    22. No person is perfect and free of flaws. Literature doesn’t have to be perfect to be good. Not every topic in a story needs to be addressed. Criticism can also happen indirectly. Sometimes you should separate the work from the artist.

      I find it amazing that you bring up these topics because they are very obviously implied to show a world that has many flaws without being questioned.

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